NGK Plug question

Discussion in 'PSI Superchargers Tech Questions' started by DCH, Jun 22, 2011.

  1. DCH

    DCH Member

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    Is there a 5/8 version of the NGK R6061-10 ??
     
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  2. SoDak

    SoDak Active Member

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    Not that I can find, but if you do, let us know. And my age old question, what is different about that plug that it supposedly makes more power?
     
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  3. Mike Canter

    Mike Canter Top Dragster
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    No there is not a 5/8 version. The plug doesn't make more power but does allow you to run more timing or go leaner without overheating the longer groundstrap of a regular plug. I myself have not found that to be a problem in a correctly tuned motor. I also prefer the longer groundstrap on a NGK R5671-10 to be an indicator if you are pushing the limit. If you push it too much you can see the sharp corners of the longer ground strap erode or round out. If you get to that point then back off. If that happens with a 6061-10 it is usually too late and damage may have been done.
     
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  4. The Dark Side

    The Dark Side New Member

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    How do you gap the 6061-10 with the short ground strap ?
     
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  5. Blownalky

    Blownalky Top Sportsman

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    Mike, would you run a R5671-10 in a correctly tuned screw blower application?

    Tom
     
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  6. Mike Canter

    Mike Canter Top Dragster
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    Yes, I would, especially on a screw blower where you add a lot of fuel at the end. There is no reason to burn a groundstrap.
     
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  7. Will Hanna

    Will Hanna We put the 'inside' in Top Alcohol
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    fast cars

    How many fast cars in NHRA or the ADRL run that plug? I'd say 99% run a 6061-10 or 6061-11...
     
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  8. Mike Canter

    Mike Canter Top Dragster
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    Not in disagreement with that Will. Do you know how many fast nitrous cars use the R5671a-10 or 11? Which one is harder on the groundstrap?
     
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  9. overkill69

    overkill69 Member

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    plugs

    I thought Drazy said the 6061 had more margin before preignition. Darren Mayer said the 5671 reads a little differently but will work. We always ran the 5671 with a roots and don't plan on running the screw lean enough to worry about minute differences.

    HUGE price difference between the two.
     
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  10. Mike Canter

    Mike Canter Top Dragster
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    Like I said the short groundstrap of the 6061 has less chance of heating up and acting as a glowplug and causing pre-ignition, we are not talking detonation but pre-ignition. Normal and correct tuning will never generate enough heat in the combustion chamber to cause that groundstrap to heat up like a glowplug. It would take a failure to cause it to get that hot and I doubt if at that point if it would make any difference if you used a 6061 or a 5671.
     
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  11. Blownalky

    Blownalky Top Sportsman

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    Yeah, my concern was the price difference. If I can run the 5671 I will but don't want to kill the motor getting it tuned. Right now with the C screw on a BBC at 92 over, 1 and 2 are stone cold while 3 and 4 are a little warmer. 5 and 6 are just starting to show heat and 7 and 8 are at the first thread. These are on 60 ft runs. I know this is a plug thread but I have run into tire shake so I can't get a consistent run and am tired of using up these expensive plugs to test. I was thinking of lowering the port nozzle size on the front cylinders which should bring up the fuel to the back and even it out. They are currently pretty much the same as the 92 over PSI recommendation but again this is a BBC and not a Hemi. The fronts are lower now in size and I'm concerned if I lean them too much, they will be lean later in the run. Open to suggestions. Thanks.

    Tom
     
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  12. overkill69

    overkill69 Member

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    chevy

    Tom I have a d rotor chevy and i'm getting ready to test next weekend. I'd love to bounce ideas off you.
    Mike Bruns 316-259-3883
     
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  13. Mike Canter

    Mike Canter Top Dragster
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    Blownalky. For a start just make your first gear run shift to second and shutdown. Check your EGTs at the one second mark, They should be averaging around 825-850* if any are higher than 850* then increase the port jet and get it cooler. If your EGTs are over 850* at that point you are not going to make it to the finish line without having the EGTs too high. I hope you are running a Low Speed Leanout just in first gear. If not then the chances are that if you are tuning just in first and second gear it will be too lean in high gear. You should shut that Low Speed Lean off at the shift to second gear. I would start out with a 60 jet. Also you will have problems with tire shake with this Low Speed Lean out because you will be down on power.
     
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  14. Blownalky

    Blownalky Top Sportsman

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    I'll double check the EGT's when I get to my other computer and I'll post them. Mike, are you saying that I'll have shake because the low speed lean out is on? ("Also you will have problems with tire shake with this Low Speed Lean out because you will be down on power.") Thought when it is on it will be lean and give me back more power, on the low end that is? Right now I have the area of a .057 jet pulled out by two solenoids at .4 into the run and I have 14 degrees taken out and ramp it back in at .5 after the luanch. I've got too much wheel speed at .3 - .4 into the run as it starts to snap the tires up then spins and smokes them and then goes into shake. This is before the leanout comes in or the timing is back Have half the area of the .057 going back in at the 1-2 shift.


    Tom
     
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  15. Mike Canter

    Mike Canter Top Dragster
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    What I am saying is you will be more prone to tire shake if you do NOT have a Low Speed lean out. For initial tuning at .5 seconds into the run you need a driveshaft rpm greater than 2600 and less than 2800. One thing you have to be real careful of is if you retard too much and at the same time too rich the motor has a hard time recovering because it will actually go too rich.
     
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  16. Blownalky

    Blownalky Top Sportsman

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    Have a driveshaft speed of 3600-3800 at .5 with the accompanying smoke. With the previous combo had about 2400-2500 at .5 with no issues.

    Been having weird EGT's on idle, #2 and #3 are way low, around 150 -200 and # 4 is about 250 and #3 is about 400. (not sure if it’s the manifold design, BBC Indy with the mods in the back for a screw or if it’s just the tune) The rest are about 860 and these are about 900-975 at 1 second in. The low ones come up some but are still way low.

    The car idles great at 1500-1600 and has great throttle response. Ran it at 78% on the barrel but the head temps were way high at 230 at idle and stage. Went to 82% and that brought them down to about 195 - 200.

    I'm running 35 total (BBC conventional head and what I ran with the Roots for three years) but taking out 14 at the hit and ramping it back in at .5. The problem I'm having is that I'm smoking the tires before the timing is coming back in and before I open the low speed lean out which should give me the lowest power. I'm thinking about going to 30 degree total and pulling out 14.

    The only thing that really bothers me about this is that at less than 60 ft I’m getting the rear plugs colored down to the 1st thread and the EGT’s are not over 1000 Not sure if that is because of a reaction delay in the EGT probes?

    Fuel pressure is 8LBS at stage (converter with trans-brake) with a 5 LB check for the dribblers, 20 LB idle check and 25 LB main check (Gorr Block).
     
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  17. Blownalky

    Blownalky Top Sportsman

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    Thanks Britt.


    Tom
     
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