BAE TA-1X vs. NRE S600 Vs. MBE

I realize no one may share this but figured I would ask. Has anyone done apples to apples dyno testing the the TA-1X, S600, And MBE heads? if so what did you find?

I can run the large valve stuff but it's a roots application so it may not help.

Thanks,
Trevor Sherwood

 

When are you going to try this stuff instead of talking about it???

 

When uncle Sam stops screwing around with me and keeps their word. Complete engine on the way now then it's just a trans and driveshaft. The next two months are going to make or break my racing operation so we'll know soon.

 

I don’t think any of it matters. Just bolting them on while on the dyno won’t prove anything. I’ve learned there is so many secrets when it comes to camshaft that it’s the only place you should spend your money. Some of the quickest pro extreme cars as of last year still use Brad 6 heads. Just sayin.... I built 3 cams over the course of 1 season. Each one got better. And the the shitty thing is no one will THE cam! They’ll sell you A cam but not the current latest and greatest .. worst part of drag racing. You’ll spend that money 3-4 times over before you even get close to a good cam.

 

Have to agree with Jay on this one. The heads are all close. One of my buddy's probably the best cylinder head guy in the world said do not drink the mbe koolaid. He said the NRE head is the best he has seen and his heads have been on the fastest pm and over in Australia. I can ask him about the bae ta-1x

 

I'm guessing your onto something and cam's didn't come into play much with the older heads as Uncle Tim tried about 3 or 4 different ones and saw no real difference back in the day. I know people have went 3.60s with the TA-1X small and big stuff and I know the MBE's have gone 3.60's as well and my crew chief recommends those. I have had the worst customer service from NRE so I am moving away from them and was just wondering if anyone saw a noticeable difference. Thanks for sharing fellas.

 

Run em!! I’ve 2 sets of nre. The first was was old x1 heads they freshened up. Ended up having a machining error on there end and they gave me the latest greatest legal heads they have. Jamie and Renee have been wonderful to deal with. Yes getting ahold of them is hard at times up. They stepped up and supported me. A nobody! Could of told me to eat it. But kept there word and gave me free, a new set of legal heads.

 

Hi Jay, Early on Jamie was great to deal and I truly believed in NRE. I too am a budget racer hence the 20 years of building a car. In 2015 I bought a new block, S600 heads, billet valve covers, gear drive, header flanges, 2 billet intakes and a spare bust panel assy. Two years later I am still waiting on some parts in which Darrel is doing his best to get wrapped up. I got hit with $1,400 in customs and taxes that I was told I wouldn't and Renee basically told me it sucks to be you. I will not purchase anything from them again as they made no attempt at making any of that right, not even so much as an apology. I will be the first to say they make a great product but I don't support companies that burn me.

 

I've personally seen 3.60 passes repeatedly from a brad 7 motor, and even out of a veney headed motor, in outlaw dragster trim. Whoever has the best customer service is who I'd go with. BAE for me, and will continue to be simply because I have had great experience with them in terms of customer service. Big money heads are great, but you'd see a lot more bang for your buck in other areas in my opinion.

 

I would like to be capable of running 3.60s in a 2550 lb roots pro mod.

I have Phil Esz's 3.604 blower from his dragster and my new motor is a S600 headed BAE motor but I will probably sell the heads and change to something either a TA-1X or an MBE deal is the reason I am asking.

Also I am looking at rather money would be better spent going to a lockup and liberty 5 spd or more blower work.

Thanks again guys for all the input, I try to do as much research as possible before diving in since I can't afford to do it twice.

 

Yeah good luck with that. Spend the money getting your car 500 lb lighter and you're golden!

I'm aware of that blower. I bought my motor from Phil, good guy and always has nice stuff. You'd be wasting your time, and money, doing anything to that blower.

The right combination in the drivetrain is the only thing that is going to get you where you want to be at this point. No matter how much research you do you're still going to end up doing it twice. Just have to go out and do it, see what works for you.

 

Some people are testing non lockup 3 speed stuff again. Saying it’s gonna be quicker in the long run. And I agree with the post above. Your gonna spend money 2-3 times over . Just go enjoy your car. You’ll never be the fastest guy. 3.70s with a roots will turn into 3.60s. Pdra is out of reach for almost every original racer who started there. $35,000 for suspension struts and shocks kills most dreams...

 

We use PDRA pro boost rules for at least one of our big races here. I noticed that PDRA has lowered the weight to 2,450 lbs with a std converter and 3 spd or 2,500 lbs for the lockup and liberty 5 spd. The kicker is that here in Bradenton for our Heads up madness deal the weight for roots is 2,575 lbs regardless of trans and converter (though this may change) and this is where I will start at. I have been told the lockup and Liberty is worth between 4 and 7 hundredths depending on who you ask so the 50 lb weight break rule in PDRA should make the setups about even now. My car is a former ADRL pro extreme car and weighed in at 2,425 as a two speed screw blown deal including my 175 lb body weight. I pulled about another 30-50 lbs out of it then put 35 lbs back in with the 3 spd so weight shouldn't be a concern. Realistically the game plan is to be able to run high 70's low 80's consistently and then be able to turn it up for the 1 or 2 big races we have here. I have realized that PDRA would require sponsorship for me to seriously consider.

Phil is a great guy, my credit card is still maxed out from buying that blower...lol. That blower is awesome but there has been some dyno proven innovation on that unit since then, just costly at 6k.

It seems I may just be money ahead by keeping what is coming with the motor vs. selling it at a loss. It went a 3.75 with a std trans and converter at my weight with a cast blower and a 3.71 with the lockup/Liberty. I suppose can always get the heads serviced outside of NRE until something newer comes along. I am going to guess that the 3 heads are all within two hundredths of each other from everyone I have spoken with. I am set on the tuning and gearing and such thanks to my crew chief so that just leaves playing with cam's, dyno work, the blower, or possibly the Liberty and lockup for improvements depending on the rules. Going to give my crew chief a call tomorrow and make these decisions easier.

Thanks again for all the info guys.

 

Seems to be the opinion of late with NRE and Renee she is not to professional in her business practices.

Chris Frank with Frankenstein cylinder heads has came out with a wicked new hemi head that is bad azz

 

Hey Sean, I know a few people who are not happy with them and I imagine once the 4.9 deal really kicks off there will be a lot more. It's a shame, they build next level designed products that function well but the customer support is so bad that it offsets it, it wouldn't have taken much to keep me happy. I have seen his stuff, looks like the Noonan stuff but I don't know of anyone running it yet.

 

How comical in Noonans new banner here, we put customers first......more like they put you last. No one and I repeat no one has anything good to say about Renee or there customer service. They have screwed so many people around it' not even funny and the head it about to be blown off of them soon. You will all see, Clint let a lot out but not all. Talk to Darrell he isnbliwn away by what they are having him try to sort out.

Truth be told, the MBE is basically an old Noonan, your best best is the TA-1X or the new Frankinstien stuff. You think Frank Manzo quickest legal NHRA pro mod thinks NRE is best.....nope. Also keep in mind Jeremy at Brad is second to none to deal with as are the guys at Frankinstein and you can not say that about Noonan. They are out for themselves, out for blood. They do not care about the customer at all.

Billy T

 

The Frankenstein head looks like a a copy of the NOONAN S600 to me. If anyone knows otherwise please correct me. I agree with camshaft and converter/clutch is the hot ticket to going fast. What works for one may not work for another.

 

Darrel is helping to get me the last of what they owe me and is a great guy. I spoke with my crew chief and decided I will run what comes with my motor until BAE makes a new head. As is this motor should do what I want and it was suggested I just focus on the lockup and Liberty deal, worry about the blower down the road as there is some ongoing innovation there. I saw the Frankenstein head and it looks like they are doing what MBE was doing which is buying billets from NRE and finishing them in house. At this point I don't want to give the Noonans another penny and I know MBE will be doing there own billets in the near future and you can never complain about Brad's service.

Has anyone figured out which is worse on the ring and pinion, the lockup or the liberty? Any good billet center section manufacturers besides Tom's or Carson Innovations? Strange maybe?

Thanks again guys,
Trev

 

Does anyone know the minimum bore for these new heads? I see BAE offer a 4.44 standard bore, but is that enough to clear the valves?

Thanks guys

 

Shrouding the valve becomes a major problem. I would say bigger is better.