re: wacked again

If you put your nitro into your 5 gallon Jug and then place it
into your 5 cubic foot cooler full of ice/dry ice etc...that would
be breaking the rules twice around.
1) the use of Ice any kind
2) once you put that jug of nitro into the cooler it becomes
a cool can,..or cool jug for that matter.

What is going to happen is,.. in the staging lanes they(nhra) will pull fuel
from all nitro/alcohol cars,..and it MUST be within the percentage of the
current outside ambient temperiture at that exact time before your run.
what percent I dont know,..if it is less or more from the current outside temperiture when tested,..you get sent back to the pits, and have
been DQ`ED from being able to make that Q run at hand.
Insulate fuel lines in dragsters from the tank to the pump is not allowed either,..if your fuel line goes across some of the chassis a small piece of padding/insulation is allowed only for the purpose to protect the fuel line at that area from rubbing on that particular piece of chro moly.

Don not qoute me on this,..I am not part of the Nhra,.nor did any Nhra official tell me this,...but hello....McCfly,..is anybody out there.


Vic

 

Wonderful work.
Stats are great.
What were the stats from years past, when A/Fuel cars were struggling to run and blowing parts up left and right, as well as hurting many people in the process?
When were the blown cars hit with rules to close the gap? Were they ever?

 

Part of the problem is how subjective this is. To give a little history from an a fuel team...
When we heard about teams cooling the fuel we started to think about what we have been doing to our fuel sitting in the trailer. We have a Chapperal "pouchside" where the fuel sits in the sides against the outside wall of the trailer. The sun would hit the side of the trailer and conduct the heat straight into the jug and then I'd pour it into the tank. We never paid attention to this.
So when we heard teams were "cooling" fuel I started to keep track of our fuel temp. I was pouring fuel into the tank at Fontana @ 105 degrees F!
I started to think about guys with those nice cool air conditioned trailers and the temp difference of their fuel.
So am I guilty of artificially heating the fuel?
Is the guy whose fuel is in the air conditioned trailer when it's hot outside guilty of cooling his fuel?
What are we supposed to do put the fuel outside the trailer?
But don't let the sun hit it, or a breeze.
I put a temp sending unit in the tank and from sitting in the lanes for one hour the reflected heat coming up from the asphault heated my fuel to over 100 degrees. Did I break the rules again?
My point is 10 degrees or a percent of ambient temp is not as easy to police as it may appear.
Johnny
TAD 734

 

Thats why I say just use a min, rule like 60 degrees in the lanes before the run , Jonny & crew that was an awsome run in pomona congrats !!

 

What if its 58 degrees outside?

 

I have news for all of you IT TAKES MORE THAN COOLING FUEL TO GO FAST. IT TAKES A GOOD TUNE UP AND ALOT OF HARD WORK.
BILL CAME UP WITH A GOOD TUNE UP FOUR YEARS AGO AND HAS BUILT ON IT EACH YEAR. SO IF YOU THINK YOU ARE GOING TO PUT ON A DIFFERENT WING OR COOL YOUR FUEL TO GO FAST THEN I WISH YOU LUCK. I WISH IT WAS THAT EASY.


Also Ethan Brown if you have a complaint about Bill why dont you go to him instead of going to the NHRA officials like you did at Bowling Green. He wasnt breaking any rule !

 

Gloria, first of all CONGRATULATIONS on another championship and thank you for everything you & Bill did for me!
Second of all I totally agree. If you think you can go fast by cooling your fuel you are an idiot!
"It is better to be thought a fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt" Mark Twain

 

Gloria,
Obviously going fast, running consistant, and becoming a 3-time world champion does not come easy. If it were, everyone would be doing it. Please know that I have great respect for Bill and his team for what has been accomplished. I remember when he had the blown car and was kikin people's asses. With that said, please do not mis understand my comments. If I have a personal issue with anyone, I am the first person to confront that person directly, but this is not a personal issue. We have a governing system at the race track, NHRA officials. That system is there to oversee, direct, and enforce rules. That was why I spoke to the official about what happened in Bowling Green.
To be honest, I was unbothered by what occurred until I realized the impact it had on other racers, particularly Blown dragster racers. Back in the pits I had to listen to 3 well known Blown dragster drivers and teams basically "bitching". Again, not by the act itself, but what was commonly known as "the arrogance" that was displayed, and the fact that NHRA assisted. And of course, the talk of the speculation of "chilling the fuel" and waiting until the last possible minute to run.
OK, so NHRA made another fuel change to AFuelers.... Do I think that Bowling Green and what I witnessed help enforce that change? Hell no, but it sure doesnt help the perception of what makes AFuel cars run fast in the heat. Do I personally think chilling fuel makes a differents? Don't know. Dont have room in my trailer to bring a freezer....LOL. Anyway, my thought is...maybe it does work, otherwise why would people do it?

As I addressed to my DIV 3 Advisor, Marty Thacker......if he cant pick up a couple hundreths by chilling alcohol, than why should we? We also have some of the fastest Blown Dragsters in the country in DIV 3:
Perry, Thacker, Bohr, Condo, and Fishburn. I want to beat them without any perception of advantage. And I will someday, all on my own.

Ethan Brown

 

For the record...how much Horsepower do you think 2% will take away??

 

does anyone even know the reason for the rule change. i just read NHRA.com again and there is no reason stated.

 

rules

try ASKING MR.collins ?
jcollins@nhra.com

Top Alcohol Dragster/Top Alcohol Funny Car
Jim Collins*
Craig Hutchinson
Jonathan Adams
Jay Hullinger
Mike Rice
Bob Lang
Rob Park
Bill Holt

looks like he is @ the top to me

 

Here's a way to cool the fuel, make an aluminum coil that goes in the tank , take the two ends and exit them out the back of the fuel tank run two # 6 lines to the fuel pump and a dummy fuel block, from the coil ,fill the tubing with nitrogen, re hook up the lines, and thats a way to cool the fuel, and yes i know it's illegal, so maybe you can catch some one with this system or some thing like it.

 

You would need a compressor capable of reaching several thousand PSI just to make the nitrogen condense. Then you would need quite a large condenser with a powerful fan to remove all that heat. And you would need to have piping that would be able to withstand that amount of pressure.

 

Oh well, never mind.

 

cooling fuel

if it didn't help the teams cooling their fuel then why did they do it especially the champ/Gloria. we ain't idiots just cause we brew the juice down in the
woods ya know

 

Dave H.
NHRA doesn't want to give any reasons why the rule change. They need to keep they're options open. If they come up with a reason then sombody might actually challenge it!!!

Who knows how much the HP will be reduced. Until the right tune-up is found the runs will be a thing of beauty ar a piece of crap. Thing is how many six second runs is it going to take to come up with a good tune-up??? If you know the answer to that you are way ahead of the learning curve.

 

I like ststistics.

Did anyone else notice these lines on the Draglist top 25 page?

For ALKYDRAG in 2008 the Avg ET is 5.5682, Avg MPH is 255.834. This entry: ET is 0.96314269 times Avg; MPH is 1.03731326 times Avg

For AFUELDRAG in 2008 the Avg ET is 5.6593, Avg MPH is 253.503. This entry: ET is 0.94729365 times Avg; MPH is 1.06677239 times Avg

Looks like the parity is the other way.

I KNOW.....Statistics LIE!

 

Averages Don't Tell The Whole Story

Unfortunately you can't just average the ET's from both classes you have to look at the standard deviation. I have not done the analysis myself, but I would be willing to be if you did the SD analysis you would find the following.

There are some very fast AFD.... a few middle of the road... and a bunch of very slow AFD. The fast offset the slow and give you the average you mentioned.

Whereas, in BAD there are a couple of very fast BAD's a whole bunch of middle of the road and a few that are very slow.

Next year with the new rules you will most likely see your numbers skewed the fast AFD will be slowed down most of the middle of the road cars will become slow cars, and the really slow cars won't even bother showing up. Note your average may not change even though the class has changed dramatically.

Of course the BAD cars will not be impacted at all by the rules changes. The really fast BAD cars will continue to be fast and skew the standard deviation. I would predict that with the head start that the BAD dragsters will have next year, by not having to overcome any rules changes. That a BAD dragster will dominate the points next year.

Remember by Division

D1 - Arthur Gallant (AFD)
D2 - Arty Allen (AFD)
D3 - Marty Thacker (BAD)
D4 - Aaron Tatum (AFD)
D5 - Edwin Schmeeckle (BAD)
D6 - Joey Severance (BAD)
D7 - Jim Whitely (BAD)

I think you have to look at the entire picture not just the nationals this shows there is parity in the class. By my count 3 AFD Division champions to 4 (BAD) division champions.

Remind me again why we made the rule change. Oh yeah NHRA never told us.
Doug

 

Well According to Speedzone's post above the top 25 ET's of '08 were all A/Fuel cars, does that statistic lie?