On The Tire column: Wheelstand prevention

The simple approach....

Just finished reading your article and think safety should always be first and foremost. But the two ideas presented seemed complicated at the least. Being a mechanical engineer and racer I have learned that the simplest approach is often the best answer for a given problem. How about using an air cylinder on the lower leg of the wheelie bar that would retract a set amount lets say two seconds into the run to lower the wheelie bar? This way you could still use the wheelie bar for off the line traction adjustment AND blow over protection. Most if not all cars already have a CO2 bottle on the car and air timers for other functions so the weight penalty would be very minimal. This is just my take on the potential problem. Drop me some mail if you would like to discuss further.
-Doug Nordberg
Young Guns Racing
'48 Fiat Topolina

 

Eliminate the Afd's?

 

Back when the Top Fuel cars were blowing over the rules were changed to NO BELLIE PANS now they require them and the blow overs are back.
Go Figure
I first wrote about this when Gene Snow blew over no one listened.

 

May be a dumb question, but if you kill the fuel, will it shut the car down fast enough to prevent a blow over. I would think that by the time the device recognizes that a blow over is happening, and shuts the fuel off, there will still be enough fuel going into the motor to complete the blow over. So, my question is, is there really anyway to kill one of these cars instantly and stop further power from being transfered to the wheels? Or are you going to cause just as much damage and potential injuries by bringing the car back down from a 45 degree or more incline? I don't know what the answer is, just some thoughts, like I said, might be dumb to some, but I was just wondering.

Edit: One more thought, at what incline point is the wind not going to help the blow over happen?

 

The obvious thing to me is that the a/f cars use to much clutch on launch if the front wheels come off the ground, so have a mandatory rule for engine set back, move the engine out father putting more weight on the front end and maybe even slow the car down a little and mybe make the class even with the alky cars. kill two birds with one stone if you will.

 

Did You Know that back in its infancy NHRA had a front/rear weight distribution rule?

 

Did you know that the only car i rember to flip over backwards ( front engine dragster) was jimmy king back in the 60's from then on he had a wheelie wheel on top of his roll bar, corse it was a joke. the thing about slowing the a/f cars down would be that if the motor was out farther they would not be abel to use so much clutch and it would slow them down, maybe even to much ,then they will want more %.

 

I remember seeing that car run once or twice around ....1970?..71?. Then they switched over to that long wheelbase duster. Loved the blue/purple paint.
I was wondering what the difference in full fuel tank & nose weight was between a top fuel car and an A fuel car having the motor out about the same distance?

 

wheely bars

I Think something on the bar itself brake or air cyl. both sound good but to shut off the fuel and maybe slam the car down do to lack of power is not the way to go. Breaking off a front wheel or front end off one of these things can be very bad also. With the power still on and a warning from the bar ether thru a brake or air cyl should give the driver time to react . Thanks: Robin

 

Just a thought

Why couldn't they incorporate a inclinometer to control front wing angle in order to keep downforce on the wing. not during a run, but at or near that point of no return...
Or...
Body flap vents (like NASCAR) that allow air through the body instead of under once air gets underneath it.

 

Reducing the size of the rear wing, number of elements, angle etc. could help. I am sure some of the computer wizards out there with the right program could calculate the effects of wing size, leverage etc. I think the huge wings are some of the problem.

 

Another thing to consider...

Aside from the issue of blowing over, another consideration is getting the car shut off should the driver become disabled. In Shelly's incident the blowover was the first part of the problem as it caused her to become incapacitated and unable to control the car, the second was the car ended up facing the starting line without anyone in control and the throttle wide open. It was at this point that the bad blowover wreck took a completely different and unthinkable course with devastating results.
Look at Ashley Force's incident a few races back. What if she had become incapacitated due the the first hard slap on the wall? Granted her car spun around with the slicks off the track surface due to the body flipping up and over and lifting the rear. If you watch, the car was still under power until she shut it down after it stopped sliding. If she had been knocked out and the throttle had been fully open, then what? If the gyro affect had allowed the car to once again get in contact with the track surface, this incident could have quickly had a devastatingly different outcome. Remember the direction her car was facing when she came to a stop.
The issue of somehow discontinuing the power to the track can apply to anytime a car and driver becomes disoriented for whatever reason on a track, whether from a spin, wall smack, crash or blowover.

 

Hey Will, just wondering what other things have been discussed, if any, about this problem. Haven't seen anything from you on this in a while.

 

I have worked on some Detroit Diesel 71 series engines that are made for the oil field work, they have a spring loaded flap on the inlet of the 71 series superchargers. They are designed to be tripped shut if the engine is accidentally run in a natural gas rich enviroment, to prevent a rpm runaway.
A diesel engine not having throttle plates means that rpm is acheived by giving it more fuel,hence giving it more fuel it will run faster.The safety flap shuts the air off and suffocates the motor.
What if you could run a cable through the wheelie bars to the safety flap trip?Having it adjusted to where a minimum amount of bending would trip the flap,shutting off all air to the engine. Top fuelers already use this method to apply the chutes in a wing strut failure.It should work equally well for a-fuel or blower. Just my 2 cents worth.

 

They do??!!

EDB