use of block filler in aluminum block,and other questions

Hi all!
i am about to have a repaired KB stage 6 hemi block machined (bores opened from 4.310 to 4.375)
since my last thread about sleeves moving easily in this block,my machine shop advised me to have the block "impregnated" with resin thus sealing the sleeves to the block(this has been done) .in addition,he advised me to add filler to the bottom of the block,to stiffen the sleeves even more and further stabilize them during the honing process.
what is your experience with block filler and aluminum blocks?
i do see two brands:hardblok and moroso providing block filler:is any of the two better for what i want to do?
i am fully aware that this process will seal the sleeves to the block so the only way to remove them would be to destroy them.
-also,the sleeves slightly protrude above the deck surface,but at different heights,so i'm also having them milled:what is a standard (or acceptable) protrusion height i should have the sleeves milled to?
application is a whipple screw blown 540 hemi with fuel heads,10.4 CR,in promod chassis.
i thank you in advance for taking the time to read this and your advice.
cyril

 

Sounds like you really need a new block.
If sleeves are loose and different heights the block is probably not square anymore.
Milling the sleeves would require making sure the o-ring receiver is also addressed and perhaps recut. If the amount needing to be removed is too much the top of the sleeve with the groove will crack.

I believe around 0.005" above deck for sleeves is the norm.

Seriously consider cutting your losses on the block and replacing it, once you scuff a sleeve that's glued in your going to have to do it anyway.

 

Sounds like that's being done wrong. First the block should be decked on both side to square it up. Then they go in and reset the sleeve shoulder height on each cylinder so any sleeve can go in any hole. Some companies offer oversized sleeves for the o.d if your not looking to change blocks. I had a block like this. Was in love with it after it was done. Proud of the repair. Had lifter bushings too. Then it broke a rod 2 races in. Needless to say all that work and money was waisted. Don't fall in love with your block lol

 

this is a wet block(when a sleeve is removed,i see the one next to it).
when my machine shop found out about my sleeves being out of round,he said i had two options:new sleeves or bigger pistons(current sleeves thickness permitting).
i went further and checked new block prices:way above my budget.
so i m going with bigger pistons and machining of what i have,as here in France,used KB blocks for sale are a rarity,and one that has not been repaired is impossible to find,even in the rest of Europe.
the difference in sleeve height is not surprising,the company that did the resin impregnation process told me they might move a little,and the machine shop did not freak out either when he saw the block and sleeves after the process.
i know it sounds like i'm putting a lot of money in trying to save that block but it is what i have and cannot afford anything better.
so if anyone has some experience with partial filling of an aluminum block that he is willing to share...

 

Any idea of what exactly they filled it with?

 

It is not filled
My machine shop is advising me to do it before the honing and decking processes.
I want to make sure i fill it(1.5 inches) with the right material,block expansion being my main concern.

 

I was referring to the “resin impregnation process”. Have any more info on that? What id does exactly, how they do it, who does it, etc. So just to clarify your going to add some grout or like material to Inside the water jackets for the first 1.5” of the sleeves?

 

it is done to aluminium blocks to seal for water leaks

 

Ok.i
Impregnation is an industrial process that consist of setting a part(or multiple parts depending on their size)in a sealed tank,that is then filled with highly pressurised hot resin for a pre-determined amount of time,then the parts are rinsed and ready for final machining.
The goal is to fill any porosity in the part.
I did work for this company for a few month and we would apply the process to aluminium 4 cylinder Volvo engine blocks,then we would pressure test some specific areas on the blocks looking for porosity leaks.
This process also stiffen the part,but i do not remember by how many percent.
This process is compatible with our specific non-cooled blown alcohol application.
This process was done to m'y block,and as you mentioned,we want to add 1.5 in of filler to the bottom of the block to further stabilize the sleeves.

 

How Loose are the sleeves at the bottom? Another option that will allow the removal of the sleeves would be to chrome the controlling diameter of the sleeve then machine it back to the size required for proper fit. Dont know the cost but it may be cheaper than a block...

 

hi
at the bottom,sleeves were tight before the impregnation process,and they are even tighter now.
and after finding some instructions about the use of hardblock filler,it says it is compatible with aluminum blocks,so ill go with that option.
thanks a lot for all the infos and input!
cyril

 

sounds like a lot of work and cost .Especially when compared to a good used block.

A fella who helped us this year does block machine work and occasionally gets some he repairs and sells. His name Is Jake and don't know his last name but can get it and number if interested send me PM. He works on Pat Dakins TF team .He is in Indy and has shop there.

Not knocking your engine builder and do not know a thing about him. Does sound to me like he has limited experiance with this type of block. IMO if he knew it needed all of this he should have advised you from the start at what you where in for cost wise.JMO

 

Hey Cyril if ur going to push it. Sell ur block and pay the difference. Get ahold of stig that runs too fuel he ain’t to far frm ya. Not sure after you cement the block can it be re welded if u break it cause u have hard block in it?

 

I’m sure you are referring to Jake Sanders.

 

thank you all for the input and advice.
this block has been repaired already(windowed on both sides,plus repairs on the center main cap.so it will never be repaired again if "something"bad happens).
-buying a used block would have put me in the same situation,regarding the machining involved or the purchase of new parts that fit in it,unless a block with standard deck and cam height, 4.375 bore and perfectly round cap bores showed up for sale.
so yes,i'm investing a lot of money in the machining of an old KB block,but it's not like there are dozens of them for sale around Europe,let alone in France.
block is at the machine shop right now,and final assembly will be done early next year,with the first pass in june,so i'll keep you posted on my success,or complete failure...
thanks again!

 

Willie I told u to send s message to stig sigarson. Look him up on the European classifieds, he has billet blocks fr sale. Don’t waste ur time brother. And money cause if it lets go u loose it all!!