Should 2 Steps Be allowed in TAD/TAFC - Driver's Poll

a driver needs to be in control of the car at these speeds. staging one of these cars is a big part of control and a big part of the run. NO BELLS OR WHISTLES! I have talked to a lot of racers and we all agree that a big reason you see so many wrecks in other sanctions is because there are way too many "driver aids" ! what's next? auto shifters?

 

No 2 step, go to s/c or a fuel

tad317 noah condo

 

no 2 steps, no data recorders, no carbon brakes, no air or electric fuel management, no points box, no teathers, no diapers, no hans, no lehey overboost or auto shutoff, no SFI . Just oil and rods all over the track. then we can sit in the stands and watch the promods. Its not back in the day, it's 2011. Wait till get a load of the new MSD 7730 pro grid system!!!

 

What he said. You forgot no 1000 lift cams.

Do 2 steps take the driver out of the equation in pro stock?

 

What's a 2-step?

 

something people do while listening to old village people records!



actually it's a 2 stage electronic rev limiter that some people use for staging with the throttle wide open.

 

I don't get it

 

Well...

The first statement was a joke. The second one is about a joke. We are the first to bitch about the costs of racing. With MSD's new "gizmo" which will probably provide ability for traction control and the 2 step on this thread, we are heading down the same path as F1 and they went out of control. Does NHRA have anyone that can figure out if someone has traction control? Let's keep it simple and try to have some fun. We are going fast enough without all the electronic marvels and their costs...I will step off the box now.

Bill Moore, Cowie TAD3

 

2step is a 2 stage electronic rev limiter. one stage is for going down track. the other stage is for on the starting line (of anywhere you want it) by applying 12 volts to the switch that applies a pre set rev limiter. it is now being used on the starting line so a driver can simply put the throttle WIDE OPEN with the engine rpm's being limited to the pre designated rpm.

 

2 step

Lets stop the complaining and do something about it. Sounds to me the best thing to do is address this with nhra. I say call your div representive and voice your concern and have them possible setup a meeting in gainesville to discuss this. The sooner we get this looked at, approved or denied, the better for everyone involved. The longer we wait the more costly it could be and the more people it will effect. I am personaly against the use of a two step. I run a converter car but still have to smash the throttle down and to me thats part of the excitement of these classes.

 

two thumbs down for two steps

WELL SAID! The two step issue is gonna change TAFC racing if it is allowed to stay.totally different gear ratios, and clutch tune up and gonna be really hard on parts. It is just a rev limiter. How many of you feel real good about your rods after you hit the limiter a couple times? I change mine because I don't want them getting upset and coming out on thier own. Now we stage the car on the limiter for perhaps four or five seconds every run. Sounds hard on parts to me. Rods, cranks, lifters. I don't think I can afford to race that way. The stuff don't last very long now!

i am proud to say I voted no also. I don't think there is any good argument for allowing it. LIke others have posted, if you can't stage and swap properly go race something else. They won't allow us to have a new blower, because they "are trying to keep the costs down", listen up NHRA...... "Keep the costs down, just say no two steps"

Clint

 

you've been punk'd

Bruce,

Chris works on Bartones car. He is playing you.

 

You will hurt parts no worse with a 2 Step than you will without it, proven fact. You limit your RPM's by intentionally misfiring cylinders to achieve your desired RPM. Either by cluch or button (converter car) you activate a bleed off valve so the motor isn't dumping fuel in it while intentionally misfiring, lets say for instance an .080 jet. You're not going to hydraulic it even if you left the bleed off out...impossible for the amount of fuel these pumps put out vs the area they're filling. The bleed off gets your fuel system closer for when the car leaves. This setup will not make the car any faster and take no different gear ratios or tuneups. It started with the converter cars because we cannot get our rpm's up before we enter the stage beams. Why the clutch teams are using it, I dont know, it will make their reaction times quicker....that's for sure; but Bartone ran quicker without it. In our car my heel and the cable attached to the heel is what brings the rpms up, I still have to hold the button, hold the footbrake, and when the tree comes down realase the brake and button and pivot my foot to wot...the same as a clutch car just different mechanics and mechanisms. Jerry is right, why sit here and piss in the wind, do you think NHRA gets on here and views the poll and says "well shit Grahm 77% of ITA says no to 2 Steps, better call Barry down in the ammendment division."? I have called and spoke to Cali, voiced my thoughts, everyone else who has a dog in the race should do so as well. Bottom line it does not make the car perform better, if Cowie had a steaming pile of shit on top of his roll cage and went 5.19 chances are we'd see everyone else follow suit. People want to complain about a $70 part that does nothing to increase performance but what about the $5800 insert/injector setup that was on several cars there? If we're going to bitch about cost then at least make it a legit one.

Brandon Booher
NHRA TAD #34

 

Bill raises a good point here and yes they can test but do they look? A tell tale sign would be a 2nd DS sensor but I'm sure there are better ways to hide it. We just have to trust that people won't cheat, you can add TC to any ignition setup via a Davis unit. MSD's new system will have their own setup (if I read the info correctly) along with a slew rate rev limiter, boost limiter etc. Basically you could build and RPM or Boost curve with this setup and set your paramters for your setup to be limited til 1.0 or 1.5 (it would activate off of WOT or a switch {12v}), then set them high as the sky and let her eat. This same setup could be done with a wastegate and is done on turbocharged cars. I would be more focused on making sure the 7730 isn't legal than a simple 2 step. A driver could still rev his car up and roll in then mash it. Leahy has his new Command Module that does everything you'd need without the extra grey matter.

Brandon Booher
NHRA TAD #34

 

Brandon
I would love to hear what Alexis would think of your steaming pile theory
get rid on them, next thing you will want to write dial ins on the side windows

 

What does one have to do with the other, I have no comment on the Rd. 1 situation @ Pomona because I wasn't there. What I did see is he didn't double bulb her, she had 7 seconds to stage the car, neither of those things happened so we have the result we do. You'd think Rick S. would have let her get it in but he saw 2 bulbs and started counting to 7. As far as the "steaming pile" it's a general statement saying someone is always first to try something and then usually if that team runs well, the rest of the field follows suit.

Brandon Booher
NHRA TAD #34

 

2-step

I am against 2-steps, if you want to run them go to a different class. I would like to see them outlaw all electronics even the computer. I believe things would be cheaper , more fun, and easier for NHRA to police. This would eliminate a lot of crap on the car. I think it sucks that we keep getting farther and farther away from what a real basic race car used to be. Just my two cents worth, Richard Putz

 

Brandon
I am not down on you just these 2 steps
i am like Richard it will just add to the cost
What is wrong with the driver driving the car
leave all the rest of the junk off
motor pulls the car and the driver controls everything
look how much wiring is in a car now
I think i would almost like to go back to one wire from the coil to the kill switch as a total

 

With a 2 step you still have to hold the hand brake and the clutch in at the same time, as complicated as that is!

By the way,I was watching a race on cable tv years ago and a big Italian guys butterflies went wide open at the starting line. So whoever said if Manzo did it eveyone else would, apparently not. I dont remember what race it was and I cant find it on you tube so I have no proof, but I know what I saw.

 

Can anyone say that a 2 step - definitely - has no effect on the longevity of the rods and crank. That is to say that you would put more than 6 or 8 runs on a set of rods.